No.3380
My attention span is kinda fucked so right now I haven't gotten to reading the manga yet and I'm an anime only, though I don't mind seeing manga spoilers so I know manga stuff. So far book of the atlantic is my favourite arc but from the snippets I've seen I can easily imagine that the green witch arc will overtake it. When I watched all the anime I watched the noncanon stuff too and while I understand why manga readers disliked it I enjoyed the anime original content just from an entertainment point of view cause it got insane at times. It's a relic from a different time and I can vibe with that. I could see the queen becoming the final villain cause the anime original content foreshadowed different manga plot points too.
No.3381
Favourite arcs would be (sorry I can't remember all the names the fandom uses for them)the Noah's ark circus arc, the ship arc and the private school one.
>>3379Alois was the best thing about season 2, I kept rooting for him. You're right in saying that his chaotic behaviour fits better for someone who's been abused, I've often felt like Ciel was way too perfect despite all the shit that happens in Kuroshitsuji (and I my favourite aspect of the green witch arc was getting to see him being more fragile).
No.3384
>>3381I'm excited for the green witch arc too! I couldn't agree with you more, Ciel's best moments are when he's vulnerable. He comes of as too composed and mentally strong for what he's gone through so it's nice to see his walls break from time to time.
No.3386
>>3380You make some good points. I can't be mad about the anime being so different. The manga was not as advanced, so the anime did not have a lot of material to work with. I like to think of season 2 as it's own thing. It's story line is interesting to me, whether was canonical or not.
No.3387
>>3378>What's your speculations for the end of the manga?Everybody lives happily ever after. I somehow doubt it will ever end.
>>3379>I know season 2 is widely dislikedBy whom?
No.3388
At this point I just suffer from stockholm syndrome and only keep reading the manga just to see if I was right all along and if Undertaker is Cedric, so Ciel's grandfather. I started reading the manga in high school and it's insane that it's still not over yet. But last time I checked the next arc will be the last one?
No.3394
>>3393The fact that someone appears just to top Sebastian makes me want to read the manga and watch all the animes. Godspeed to you, nona.
No.3395
>>3393I always imagined wolfram to be blond but I guess it makes sense for him to have gray hair (you know, like a wolf).
Also apparently he's going to be voiced by the same seiyuu who voices the wolf from beastars, which I find very hilarious for how on the nose it is.
No.3398
>>3397>would the fans be happyi think it'd be a bit of a cop-out and i'm not sure a happy ending would fit this series.
at the same time, i feel like the only type of ending that would satisfy me is one where its vaguely implied that theres more between sebaciel, in a way where you can interpret them romantically if you want but it's not overly clear, and they somehow stay together lmao so i'm conflicted
No.3402
>>3395Kek that is perfect casting
>>3397>Would the fans be happy if he somehow got out of it?I think most fan are hoping for the two to stay together in some way.
Personally, the only thing I want in the end is to see Sebastian get Ciel's soul. He's the only one I care about being happy in the end.
No.3403
I've gone back and forth so many times on how I want the manga to end, I just don't know. All things considered it's probably true that a tragic ending makes the most sense. All I know for sure is that if Yana is still into Sebaciel I want her to add a scene that antis can't cope their way out of. I want to see the meltdown cause it'd be funny.
No.3404
>>3403I expect a tragic or bittersweet ending. Bittersweet as in "I reached my goal and avenged
my brother and myself and can die with no regret" but there are so many mysteries that I mostly worry about how the ending will happen. I'd be mad if some questions aren't answered even after the end of the manga, I started reading it when I was in high school and this shit is still not over yet so Yana better deliver a satisfying conclusion regardless of whether Ciel lives or dies.
No.3406
>>3405That's amazing. Bless her.
No.3407
>>3405I wish she didn't delete her old blog…
No.3414
>>3405God, she is so perfect. She literally our queen.
No.3415
>>3408>so what is causing more acceptance compared to the absolute moral panic shitshow of the late 2010s?I didn't notice much of a panic in the late 2010's. Most of the craziness I've seen came after the fourth season aired earlier this year.
Strictly speaking from the western side of the fandom, it looks like most of the acceptance is brought on by og fans just not succumbing to their anti bullshit, or calling them out on watching "problematic" media in the first place. I've seen lots of examples of this on tumblr and pinterest. Though it might just be the site's culture, reddit is still very much a cesspool of anti thought. I have no idea what the fandoms on twitter, bluesky, or tiktok are like. It's crazy that some people will just enter a 16 year old fandom and think that they can bully others and change things. It makes me happy to see that at least some of the og fans are standing their ground.
No.3506
>What's your speculations for the end of the manga?
I just have this feeling Ciel will die and I hate it.
No.3507
>>3506I'm expecting a fake-out death tbh.
No.3508
>>3507Also likely. In some way or another, Ciel probably won't be able to show his face to the public anymore LOL
No.3517
>What's your speculations for the end of the manga?
I do think that Ciel will reach his goal but at the cost of everyone he knows. rip Snake and Agni I have a feeling that he will lose (sacrifice) a great deal of the people closest to him. The servants and probably even Lizzy will realize that they've traded their loyalty and love just to be used as pawns. The ending will be bloody and sad and while Ciel truly begins to come to terms with his actions, his soul will be snatch away. Sebastian, business as always, takes his payment.
Honestly, I want the craziest, saddest, most twisted ending possible. I've been with this series for years, I feel like it just needs a big dramatic conclusion.
No.3583
>>3405I took a look at her insta and it's so cute. I love seeing her enjoy herself with her plushies. I hope she enjoys the rest of her vacation.
I'm chuckling at the comment of her posts, tho, people are arguing over her being a sebasciel shipper. Like of course she is, it's so obvious. Shippers have been taking travel pics with their ship merch/figs/plushies for decades. There are so many blogs that do the same. I swear antis just love to act like they're clueless. I could never understand them.
Also the cutest things are her cats. Of course she has a black and grey one,lol. The grey one also has a little blue ribbon, so obvious. That is just so cute. Pics attached
No.3584
>>3517> I want the craziest, saddest, most twisted ending possibleSeconding this. I want everyone involved to be miserable forever. To be honest I can't even imagine a happy ending for this story. It just doesn't work.
>>3583I had no idea she had cats! They're so adorable! And their fur colour being the same as sebaciel's hair colour; she's not even trying to hide it anymore kek that madwoman.
No.3585
>>3517>>3584Agreed that I want the ending to be crazy. It's the only way I can see the story ending.
Additionally, I'm hoping we get a moment where Sebastian's hunger gets the best of him. It's been brought up in the story a couple of times that he's starving, but keeps himself controlled. I hope those moments were some kind of foreshadowing. He's always so perfect and composed, I just want to see a wrench thrown into the plot and see his perfect mask ripped away.
No.3586
>>3585I think it would be funny if he didn't want to eat Ciel but instinct took over.
No.3587
>>3586Yes! Would love to see him acting erratically and lose control. I want to see him try to fight his insticts and fail. Just one moment he's pouring tea, and the next, trying to hide a growl or accidentally shape-shifts, or loses concentration in some goofy way.
No.3589
>>3586Oh my god that would be so perfect and dramatic
No.3590
>>3586It could happen, right? His whole thing is how he wants to eat Ciel's soul because he's so mentally fucked up
or maybe because he could be related to Undertaker, who knows it would taste good, as opposed to eating other souls that would just taste normal. Maybe Sebastian is developing a supernatural eating disorder without realizing it.
No.3902
>>3901Is the other guy a lolicon?
No.3903
>>3902Not when Sebastian fucks the shit out of him.
No.3904
>>3903Bro Sebastian is cucking lolis AND cheating on Ciel
Children on suicide watch.
No.3906
>>3904Sebastian is made to passed around like a blunt it would be a travesty if only ciel tasted his demon cock
No.3907
>>3906This is why I preferred Claude and Alois.
No.3921
>>3901So hype! It was nice seeing Sebastian back where he belongs: between Ciel's legs kek!
No.3926
>>3925Everyone on fujochan crashing the wedding in a slapstick comedy movie fashion to see Sebastian and Ciel finally tying the knot.
No.3927
>>3925Holy, that sebastian design in the second pic…
No.3928
>>3927 it's going to be one hell of a honeymoon
No.3929
>>3927Am I the only one way too bothered by that single strand of hair on the right tucked behind his ear though? I want to gel it back for him.
No.3932
>>3901Ruined by the addition of the loli. Completely unnecessary.
No.3942
>>3932Sullivan isn't so bad, she's there for gags anyway. It's been a riot watching antis freak out about her in today's episode. Maybe now they'll believe that kuro isn't the comfycore paternal bullshit that they keep insisting it is and they all get the fuck out of the fandom. The school arc is over and shits only going to get darker.
No.3990
I can't find the 214th chapter anywhere, where is it? I'm not paying for it, I already buy physical copies of the manga but volume 35 will be released the next decade if this keeps up.
No.3996
>>3990Found this with a simple Google search nona.
https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1lWd9UilVA78c7iV4feXCXgp553QV15pRAlso, goddamn the fan artists work fast. This new guy just showed up for the first time yesterday and they're already lewding him kek
No.3997
>>3996Anon I love you so much, thank you! The cliffhanger is killing me, I need more. But I'm glad this chapter is longer than 15 pages.
>they're already lewding him kekUnderstandable tbh
No.4036
This week's episode was something else! It did not disappoint. We got a foot shot! Sadly, his toenails were not painted black, like I hoped.
I also lost it when he tasted their boy soup.
>>3996Bless the fanartists! They're so fast
No.4121
>>3942i agree! sullivan is cute, and i like how she's anti meltdown fuel.
>The school arc is over and shits only going to get darkerlmao yeah and shotacon-er, im so excited for all the sebaciel content in the emerald witch arc, plus more food that we'll surely be getting at the hotel
No.4123
>>4120It's been that long since we saw them in the manga? I swear I've lost track of time it couldn't have been that long, right?
No.4129
>>4123dont take my word for it nonnie, but i think they didnt appear in the manga for about 3.5 years, and right after they came back, yana took a year long hiatus
No.4140
>>4130>>4137I guess the antis who aren't on team "They have a father and son dynamic" instead take the tentacle scene at face value to say Sebastian doesn't care about him.
No.4143
>>4140>They have a father and son dynamicyou hit the nail on the head nona. i find this new rhetoric of dadbastian very stupid and an obvious cope
>take the tentacle scene at face valueyeah this too. to me it has always been pretty obvious that the scene was just sebastian snapping ciel out of his trauma response state, iirc he later explicitly states he wasn't actually going to eat his soul. it's beyond me how people think it's proof he does not care, but i guess antis aren't exactly smart
No.4144
i hate how the new gen 'fandom' mischaracterizes sebastian.
to add to the antis interpretation of sebastian and ciel's relationship, it's so weird how they claim that sebastian is a parental figure to ciel.
sebastian does not act like a father to ciel, just what. if your dad acts like sebastian call the cops.
somehow, the dadbastian meme manages to co-exist with the other part of the fandom who says sebastian is unable to feel anything at all. antis have been stuck at the "sebastian does not care about ciel" stage for years now.
sebastian has changed since the start of the series (as it's normal for characters to do) showing more emotion and empathy towards ciel and other characters, too. it's like antis can't conceptualize that it's possible for a character to evolve, and since sebastian was shown to be detached and self-serving at the start, then it means he will never be anything more than that. nuance completely flies over these people's head.
but imo, the worst of them all is people who say sebastian is a predator (lmao). they paint him like he's the actual antagonist of the series and ciel is his poor victim who is constantly abused and ruined by his evil influence.
i mean, hot, and true to an extent, but they forget that sebastian is the titular main character who is ciel's saviour and is helping him against the real villains. he takes very good care of ciel going way beyond his contract duties, and even has his own twisted semblance of morality
No.4146
>>4144 (forgive my dissertation in yaoi ethics,)
You've hit the mark in so many ways with your post. What I love about BB is how nuanced the storytelling and characterization are. It's hard for me to imagine that people actually read it and picked the two extremes to defend. It's so silly, they most certainly don't have a paternal relationship, and making Sebastian seem like a callous monster is so blind, too. Literally it is just a cope to protect their fragile egos, if the fucking dadbastian claim falls through at least they can shrug and be, "welp, he was a demon anyways."
What I like is the push and pull of their relationship. Firstly, I saw them as business partners who have a sick-desperate kind of reliance on each other. I love that they need each other, but must remain guarded to an extent. Seeing how they have to struggle with their boundaries and trust, mhua! Fucking chefs kiss. Truly a delicious cherry on the dark, gothic cake. Throughout the series, seeing how their relationship developed and grew has been nice. BOTA does this so well. I also love seeing how Sebastian has personally grown. And then we got to see how he takes in what other characters teach him, like in the BOTC, it was honestly a surprise to see him learn from Agni and Soma, and it truly still shows within the witch arc. The moment he saw that Ciel was incapacitated, he could have taken Ciel’s soul right then and there. He didn’t have to return him to the castle, ask for Sullivan’s help, or even wait as long as he did before he activated the tentacle vore lol. He has never shown another human this kind of mercy.
What bothers me the most is how both sides have such similar mindsets in how they perceive Ciel. It's such a discredit to his character. They view him as just this weak and defenseless boy who was manipulated or needs rescuing (it's probably projection from their end. Those types love to paint themselves as the victims and then project onto their comfort characters. It’s such an immature mindset, like they literally cannot think beyond themselves. They have forgotten how clever and cunning Ciel actually is. Sure, he was put into the worst situation possible, and under stress and grief at the time of their meeting, but he holds the reins, uses Sebastian as his chest piece, and he was the one who set the conditions to their arrangement.
Yana conveys this so well in the extra chapter of Arthur Doyle's fairytales. Ciel doesn't want to be saved; he wants to be here.
No.4147
>>4146alexa play j cole, no role modelz
"don't save her, she don't wanna be saved~"
No.4148
All this talk makes me laugh becaus the last time I interacted with the fandom was around 2011 or 2012 when everyone was still talking about the 2nd season and the manga. I wasn't in English and the discussions were typically "omg what's going to happen in the next episode/chapter?" and "Elizabeth is useless" (that was before the Campania arc for context) and "I hate Claude". Thinking about how some of the people you're all complaining about weren't even born yet when the manga started should be the number one argument as to why their opinions don't matter by the way.
No.4149
>>4146nona what else can i say if not ily? i completely agree with everything you said. i wanted to talk more about how ciel's character is misunderstood as well in my first post, but i was afraid of it getting too long.
the fact that antis project onto ciel and it shapes up their view of his personality and his dynamics with sebastian erroneously is so, so true. most antis are women, and ever since the very start of kuroshitsuji, ciel has been a self-insert of sorts for the girls. i think this is partly the intention of yana herself too, though thankfully ciel doesn't suffer from the lack of personality that is often found in characters with this role for the readers.
but in the past, the women who identified with ciel did not see sebastian as the big bad wolf. they acknowledged his layered character and it made him even more attractive. i guess many younger women in the fandom these days are the ~special snowflake~ kind who love to play the victim.
another interesting thing is the views of men into kuroshitsuji, too. they've always been a bit of a minority, so gauging a sample of what they think can be hard, but back in the day, it was very obvious that they all wanted to be sebastian lol. and it just made sense, because sebastian is the more masculine out of the two, both physically and in his role within the relationship, he is the strong guy who protects the weaker one, is super charming and popular with women and is a very active character who is able to do everything.
now i've noticed a rise of men who identify with ciel, which is so fascinatig to me because the more passive position that ciel has evidently appeals to a generation of men who follows the "soft boi" aesthetic, want mommy gf and refuse to do anything. and of course, they too paint sebastian like evil incarnate and ciel as a poor little thing with no agency in their relationship
and omg the ice king chapter is so beautiful. lizzy being btfo'd was so satisfying to see lol
No.4151
>>4149Thank you! I'm happy to see that others agree. Ciel is such a great character, I hate how he's been misrepresented.
Pretty much the only male fans of kuro I've seen have come from 4chan and they pretty much see Ciel as their boywife, while Sebastian is seen as their competition, kek. I guess I can't be surprised. Femboys are popular now and for some reason all shotas have been absorbed into that group.
No.4153
>>4152the adaptation of the asthma scene in book of circus did not disappoint, it was so hot. i have high hopes for the tentacle sex, though i dont think it's the same studio anymore? not sure
No.4154
>>4153Yes, kuro has been with CloverWorks since the Public School Arc. I'm really curious to see how tomorrow turns out too. I hope they don't disappoint.
No.4158
>>4157someone on twitter said that it represents him choosing sebastian over everyone else. yana tweeted that ciel's choice represents him choosing revenge over everything else. antis immediately jumped on sebaciels calling them delusional and the usual stuff, lmfao
btw anyone else likes vincent x diederich?
No.4159
>>4158the discourse is whack. much like a chip with salsa, sebastian is the best vehicle for revenge. Even just for this reason, ciel still needs him and will choose him again and again (anne made some cute art, always a banger)
I love them ahh. You just know that vincent and diedrich fucked around in school at some point. that butler nursing was an adorable chapter. vincent is such a freak
No.4160
>>4159i swear antis are always up to start the dumbest discourse imaginable, and it all falls apart even more miserably when you remember that yana drew shotacon of characters that look exactly like sebastian and ciel. if i was an anti i wouldnt even have started the series. now that we have them back together 24/7 in a luxury hotel i can just picture antis with a soyjak face at every new chapter we'll get
vincent is indeed a freak omg and they're in my ships that canonically at least frotted back in school list. it's interesting because they remind me of sebaciel in a lot of ways, you can tell that yana likes this dynamic
cute pic nona ♥
No.4161
Why isn't Sebaciel canon? Yana is a fujo, her audience are all fujos, so what's stopping her? I'm not in the fandom, just genuinely curious
No.4162
>>4160it was always strange to me that there are so many new fans who are against the shipping aspect of the series. sure, kuro isn't as in your face as something like loveless but it's obvious what kind of series this is. they are truly delusional.
kek yana is so committed to her aesthetic. she delivers the same gift in a different package each time
No.4163
>>4161I think it's because Kuroshitsuji gets published in a shounen magazine, their editors probably won't allow it. Maybe it's time for her to upgrade to a seinen magazine or something the way Araki did with Jojo.
No.4164
>>4161as
>>4163 said it's likely because of the magazine kuro is published on. i think this has to do with yana's own taste too though, i have a feeling that even if she could canonize sebaciel she would not. she's said before she thinks writing romance is exhausting and she feels more comfortable with action-centered stories.
i like it better this way too tbh. the tension, subtext and subtle eroticism of their relationship is what draws me to the ship and it'd be lost if they became canon.
i've always been more of a fanon shipper fujo than a BL reader one tho
No.4171
>>4163>>4162Kuroshitsuji is the only bl-hinting manga I would read continuously. Straight canon bl is boring. With kuroshitsuji you have other plot aspects and it is the action and other character interactions that makes it whole. That's why it's so popular because it's a complete story and it doesn't only focus on the main pair but develops the other characters as well.
No.4172
>>4154I don't like the cgi teacups
No.4174
>>4172I hadn't even noticed the cgi teacups.
I've only ever noticed the horses
No.4200
>>4199What what WHAT??? What the hell is this?? New chapter??
No.4202
>>4199What if his neck tattoo is a mark just like Ciel's mark on his eye or Alois' mark on his tongue? What if it covers much more than his neck? Maybe this new guy signed a contract with another demon and he's getting both of them confused for some reason? It's insane how much more interesting the manga became once Sebastian and Ciel came back.
No.4208
>>4199I have lost ALL respect for this dumbass (lovingly)
>>4202Could be true, Nonners? I'd bet on an imposter tease sometime soon.
I loved how crazy and dramatic things have gotten. I'm glad the leading boys are back.
No.4209
>>4199lol sebastian is becoming more and more human and it is so cute to see. he's so silly
yana really went for the bpd ex trope… i giggled the whole chapter especially at ciel wanting to know all about sebastian's contractors. jealousy? ♡
No.4221
>>4216of course! The manga drop is like a holiday for me, kek
No.4222
>>4216I will post here anytime a new chapter will drop, I don't talk about the latest arcs to friends because they haven't read every yet and screaming about it on social media isn't the same.
No.4250
>>4249I never read the manga so my first thought was that it's a hilariously complicated ruse to create a whole amish fantasy village to trick a child into making a WMD, not to mention the hilarity of werewolves and witch magic being fake but demons and reapers aren't.
No.4251
>>4250Storywise it's still the same as the manga. I was talking about some changes in the art style/ how cloverworks presented the scenes. I just feel like the manga has more of an impact. Sully's whole world crumbled around her, I just didn't feel the anime reflected enough of that mood.
No.4282
>>4281>if you prefer me "beastly" I'll act the part for you.Oh my god Sebastian is so embarrassing! An ancient demon being so pussywhipped by a little boy, to the point where he starts enjoying behaving like a human servant and being demonic and "beastly" becomes an act he has to put on for him. That is so, so goddamn pathetic I love it!
Also, I'm so ready for
Ciel in a dress (again) next episode!
No.4286
>>4283I want that but with cigarette smoke in my face…
No.4318
>>4317God damn that veiny fist… Cloverworks really worked hard
No.4338
>>4317That episode was incredible! So many of the scenes were just beautiful. I especially loved this frame of Sebastian, it was always my favorite manga scene of him. Cloverworks did a great job with this one.
I hope we also get a filler episode at the end of this arc, like how they ended Public School. Would love to see the Diedie cooking segment extra. It was hilarious, I really lost it at Vi realizing that one of his sons is as much of a psychopath as he is. Crazy really runs in the family kek.