/f/ - Fandom Generals

>>3761
We didn't have a thread here before? It's fujo 101.

Anyway

BBS
Xehanort (all of them)
SoXeha
Overblown by dudebros in the 00's who couldn't grasp the basic concepts of the story as they spell them out. Even if you play out of order, nothing is left unexplained and what isn't explained is done intentionally so. A concept that Let's Players didn't want to acknowledge because it'd make them look dumb.

I know back in the day, releases were uneven on top of being on different platforms but that never stopped me from just seeking the information out which is what a ton of people never tried and blamed their inability to research on the games. I'm being bitter about it because I refused to be gaslit into thinking it was always confusing when no, it never was.

Another KH nonna wrapping up with KH2.5. Found this enjoyable sfw soriku dj about them on Destiny Islands, spoiler free for lore stuff to anyone still playing through the games.
https://myreadingmanga.info/rs-kingdom-hearts-dj-innocent-engpt/#top

So far
>Favorite game?
Probably KH2.5
>Favorite character?
Sora!
>Favorite ship and why?
SoRiku because I'm basic but also VanVen
>Is lore being confusing overblown or is Nomura way too ambitious with his Disney x Final Fantasy fanfiction?
I like the lore and how sincere the games feel. I prefer too much ambition much more over too little.

I love them so much

Been avoiding this thread until I finished KH2 and I just beat it tonight!

I thought the opening bit in Twilight Town was the strongest part of the game and was very melancholic in all the right ways. It also had a nice SoL feel and I'm sure at least an hour of my playthrough is just me skateboarding around it. Rest of the game had it's moments but it was very frontloaded. At some point in the middle of the game I grew a bit tired of the Disney stuff and checked out, like I could care less about genie-Jafar terrorizing Agrabah again, and it made me wish they were better integrated into the main plot, the Tron world was oddly enough the best in this regard. Still when the stuff with Organization XII was allowed to happen it was engaging and the game in general had a better story than the first one.

On a fujo note, Sora/Riku shippers I see the vision, especially in the ending cutscenes, but I'm hooked on Roxas/Axel and am super excited to check out 365 Days for them.

>>4293
You're going to love 365/Days nonna

Kingdom Hearts is one of my favorite series ever, though I have not interacted with the fandom too much, especially the modern iteration as ships like AkuRoku have been deemed ~problematic~ which means you're a pedo for loving them.
The widespread headcanon that Axel is a father figure to Roxas is such a cope, what is even fatherly about their relationship?
I don't want to sound like a conspiracy theorist but sometimes it feels like Roxas/Xion and Axel/Saix shippers have come up with a perfect way to completely dismiss their biggest rival ship by framing it as pedophilic and pseudo-incestuous and unfortunately it worked. AkuSai is now the most popular Axel ship and while I also like them I doubt they would be as popular if anti sentiment wasn't so prevalent in fandoms now.

>>4296
I will never forgive modern fandom for their crusade against Akuroku. This ship was everywhere when KH2 was out and I loved it. Axel isn't even that much older than Roxas anyway. I fucking hate Xion, easily one of the worst women in the series. And Saix/Isa is boring. How the hell did AkuSai become more popular when they hardly did squat in BBS and KH3? I feel like I'm going insane.

God I hope Demyx is the Master of Masters so everyone can go back to shipping him and Xigbar despite the "age difference."

>>4296
>>4297
I'm not a huge Roxas or Axel fan but it's obvious AkuRoku is the way to go, like c'mon. It's so on the nose in kh2 and days. The fatherly figure thing is a well-known cope across many fandoms, wtf are they talking about here though kek

>>4296
I don't know how you can frame it as fatherly, if anything it seems like "just friends" would be the easier cope. I actually can't tell if it intentionally has homoerotic undertones or if it's just the localization, but it definitely doesn't feel familial.

>>4297
Call me a misogynist but I honestly dislike all female characters in KH. Xion had no reason to even be in the story because a Nobody (or a vessel in her case) realizing that they could exist as their own person and live the life they want was already explored in Roxas' character, she's just an inferior version of him. Also I hate that everyone headcanons her as trans, why do people always do this to non-human characters?
I hate how Nomura cannot have two guys being close friends, he ALWAYS has to make it a trio with a girl included. Axel being Roxas' only and closest friend in the Organization was completely retconned in Days where it turns out that he had another friend all along but the reason she was never mentioned in KH2 was because everyone forgot about her. Really? And again, in KH3 where apparently Axel and Saix were searching for their childhood female friend the whole time when there was never any mention of her before? His obsession with trios is so annoying.
I do understand why people ship AkuSai though, they are childhood friends and Saix's jealousy over Axel finding new friends and spending more time with them makes for an interesting dynamic but AkuRoku is superior in every way.

>>4300
>Also I hate that everyone headcanons her as trans, why do people always do this to non-human characters?
wtf? literally why? I'm glad I don't interact with the fandom ever
>Call me a misogynist but I honestly dislike all female characters in KH.
I like Aqua and Larxene but I've also noticed the female characters aren't very many and are usually really bland. Why is there only one woman in Organization 13? Why is Kairi so useless? It all reminds of Naruto in a bad way. All of the straight "canon"-hinted pairings have no chemistry either. I've actually been into KH ff where they give the female characters stronger rewrites or personality

>>4301
You're blessed to have not seen trans Xion nonna because I see it everywhere. The logic is that because Xion started to view herself as a girl and not just as an extension of Sora means she accepted herself as a brave trans woman and Xemnas and Saix are transphobic bigots for referring to her as "it". Any character who struggles with their identity is "trans coded" now.

Aqua is the only female character with a game of her own but even that one was very short. MoM was supposed to be Kairi's game but Sora ended up saving the day like he always does with Kairi once again being on the sidelines watching Riku chasing after Sora lol. SoKai are supposed to be central romantic pairing in the series but Kairi barely even participated in the events of the games. She was inside Sora in KH1, stuck on an island in CoM, kidnapped by the villain in KH2 and kidnapped by the villain again in KH3 despite being trained as a keyblade wielder. The writers seriously don't know what to do with her.

>>4302
>because Xion started to view herself as a girl and not just as an extension of Sora means she accepted herself as a brave trans woman
Literally wtf is that logic?? Just because she was a vessel doesn't mean that she was male. That makes no sense. I never would have even thought of her as transbait for western fandoms the way Naoko or any other gender non-conforming character is for room temperature retards. She definitely isn't unambiguously trans, and the Japanese fandom definitely doesn't view her that way. You would think this would be in an Ultimania or two if she was "unambiguously trans" too. I'm siding with Xemnas and Saix for being based lmfao.

I'm on KH3D and haven't played KH3, but I've been so disappointed with Kairi as a major series grip as well. KH2 was the real kicker for me, she never even fights with you or joins your party at any point unlike Riku in the last world. She's barely there in the games and you never get her story or perspective since she's on the island… Meanwhile Riku and Sora just homoerotically obsesses each other like 5000x. I hope they never make the SoKai pairing canon-canon even if it's the obvious main romantic pairing. Kairi is so boring I thought Xion was impressive because at least she fought in Days…

Also I hate how Kairi's outfit (in KH2 especially) showed so much more skin while the other characters were normal and covered lmao

Why are Japanese writers obsessed with this trio concept of a red oni genki boy, a blue oni edgy boy, and THE GIRL just in general? Make it fucking stop.

>>4303
You can argue that Xion was male at one point because she has Sora's memories and wore his face at the end of Days but even that is a stretch.

I've seen people saying that Kairi was never meant to be a keyblade wielder and they made her one just to appease fans who wanted her to be a girlboss and I have to agree. The way that Riku just shoved a keyblade in her face in KH2 was so funny, they introduced that out of nowhere. She was not meant to be a fighter, even her Nobody Namine can't wield a keyblade while Roxas can with no problem. Xion and Aqua do fight and Aqua is even a keyblade master so it's not as if all women do nothing. Kairi is in an awkward position I think where fans have different expectations of her character compared to what she actually is in canon.

Sora does love Kairi and they have the whole paopu fruit thing going on so I think it's safe to say that they will eventually be confirmed canon but I am coping by thinking that at least Riku's love for Sora will never go away. Riku does literally everything for Sora, he sacrificed himself countless times to protect Sora, he thinks Sora is his most precious person but I'm supposed to believe that Kairi hugging Sora and sending him letters is the real love story here.

I hope you enjoy DDD, it's the most homo game in the series. My SoRiku heart was enjoying every minute of it.

>>4304
So it's my interpretation of the character that Kairi is a meta commentary on female characters in a JRPG.

However, Nomura bumbled the execution by making her the definitive love interest to Riku's complete jealousy and acceptance that he wasn't Sora's favorite anymore because KH was never supposed to keep going after KH1

Kairi by KH3 is no longer the love interest- but she's trying really hard to be. Both her And Lea went though an anime training session to join the fight and they both lose. They both suck. But people comment on Kairi more than to Lea despite them having the exact same training at the exact same time.

I feel like that was intentional so it wouldn't just be a gender thing.

Kairi forces herself to fight, forces the paopu fruit on Sora (he literally does not want to share it with her, his head shakes in a definite NO when she puts it in front of him). She's banging her fists on the glass of the narrative to be the main girl again but is destined to be the damsel.

Sora has shown that he will kill for every single person he cares about. So when she's hurt, he doesn't fly off the handle because he loves her like a partner, it's because he would do the same for anyone. I read about so many changed lines in the English version of KH3 which adds on to the masking of intentions. Everything's so much more open in Japanese about the roles everyone takes and and the fandom being hugely English speaking takes the bad one.

Trying to keep this mostly spoiler free for anon but I needed to be clear.

>>4304
>I think it's safe to say that they will eventually be confirmed canon
I'm huffing copium and hoping that keep it ambiguous for the sheer amount of fujoshi in the fandom. At least they can't take away picrel or AkuRoku

>>4305
Interesting thoughts nonna! I'm so used to badly developed and forced het romance I didn't think that Kairi's case could have been intentional. Kairi feels more like a traditional damsel heroine like Rosa from FF4, even the love triangle between Sora/Riku/Kairi feels similar to Cecil/Kain/Rosa on the surface except Kain is actually gay this time. Riku even wanted to name the boat in KH1 Highwind.

Sora in the paopu fruit scene in KH3 still makes me laugh, he looked so confused and even backed away from her for a moment. If the scene was not meant to be romantic his reaction makes more sense.

I've read about KH3's translation being bad but I'm too retarded to learn Japanese so I'm stuck with the inferior version. I know a lot of nuance from Japanese is lost in English like the aitsu thing in CoM where the pronouns are more ambiguous but the English translation only used "she" and made it explicitly about Kairi.

>>4306
They tried to no-homo VanVen already in KH3 when Vanitas said that Ven is his brother but it doesn't bother me, I think it makes the ship even better lol

>>4307
I'm too scared to hover over the spoiler until I play the game myself. I hope it's not too bad. Why do I do this to myself with ships from non-BL media?

>>4305
I've seen similar "heroine meta" posts applied to Ochako MHA over the years and we all know how that ended (fujoshi 9/11). I don't think Nomura is that insightful of a writer, he's just an ideas guy with a budget.
>>4307
>Cecil/Kain/Rosa
>Highwind.
I cannot believe I never caught that could be Kain FF4 and not Cid FF7, huge brain anon.
>>4308
>Why do I do this to myself with ships from non-BL media?
Because the ship sails babyyyyyyyy

>>4308
It's not that bad nonna don't worry, there's no forced het or anything. Sora and Terra are the only potential hetboys in the series, everyone else is safe. Even fucking Xehanort had gay shit going on with Eraqus.

>>4309
I initially played KH because I love FF so I was on the lookout for any references. These days I am more into KH because after FF15 and FF16 I lost all hope for the franchise reaching former greatness again. Noctis/Luna and Clive/Jill are somehow even worse than SoKai.

>>4304
> I think where fans have different expectations of her character compared to what she actually is in canon.

By fans you mean yumes who self-insert into Kairi. That's what Kairi "fans" are, and that's what they always have been, unlike fujos who most of the time ship because of dynamics, straight shippers are 80% yumes who like the boy (in this case Sora) and 20% people who like the dynamics of the characters.
Kairi is just the yume self-insert, that's why she is so bland, she perfectly fulfills the role for girls to create fanfictions with their personality into her, that's why there is even infighting in the first place about what kind of personality she has kek because of headcanon clashes.
Also Nomura based Kairi on Utada Hikaru, at the time she was huuuge in Japan and her songs could be heard everywhere, so she was kinda of an homage character to Utada Hikaru, which is why she was never as developed as other female characters created by him, like the ones from FF.
The same happened with Xion, she was created due to Tomoko Kanemaki, she wrote majority of her character, she also wanted her to have black hair too for some reason which is why she doesn't have red hair like Kairi, what happened to her fandom is unfortunate, I really used to like her, I even made fanarts of her back in 2013, but like always, fandom attract the worst kind of people, and those who attach themselves too much to fictional characters ruin everything.

>>4310
>Sora and Terra are the only potential hetboys in the series, everyone else is safe
oh fuck thank you for this. I can cope with the expected SoKai with Riku's overt homosexual love and his internal selfcest harem at least.

>>4311
>that's why there is even infighting in the first place about what kind of personality she has
She has a personality?

Can yumes and straight shippers at least not be offended when other fans don't like how bland Kairi is? I've seen this time and time again across different fandoms. Also it must be sad self-inserting as Kairi since she doesn't even travel with him across his adventure… just kidnapped and writes letters and goes to school and gets kidnapped again apparently… okay

>>4312
>>4311
>She has a personality?

A boring personality is still a personality, but yeah very weak Larxene is the only female KH character I like.

To play devils advocate she represents a return to normalcy and simpler time for Sora. That firmly puts her in the "plot device" category but still the passive and supportive personality fits the role. You could also possibly use Namine to argue she's got a deeper more possessive streak, but that might be grasping at straws. It's really funny that in KH1 you could completely remove her from the story with almost no changes. I like that they try to give her more to do later but she feels like a character who they struggle to find something to do.

>Also Nomura based Kairi on Utada Hikaru
That's a really neat fun fact, didn't know that.

>>4311
Kairi fans remind me of Sakura fans in this regard. They delude themselves into thinking Kairi is the third protagonist of the games and then get pissy when she gets kidnapped once again, calling Nomura a woman hater as if Kairi ever does anything in the games. I wish yumes just quietly shipped their ship instead of calling anyone who criticizes a badly written damsel a misogynist.

>>4312
Selfcest is wincest.

>>4313
>she's got a deeper more possessive streak
Kairi is very possessive of Sora, in KH1 she wanted to leave the island only with him and leave Riku behind. She made the wayfinder for Sora only and not her other friend unlike Aqua who made it for both Terra and Ventus

>>4315
Adding onto this. THAT scene.

The Winnie the Pool parallel. (I don' t know how to spoiler an image so have this as a replacement) Sora looks genuinely done with how Pooh is trying to keep him in the woods, like an older brother who loves his little brother but doesn't want to outright say that he's being annoying.

The reflection in the paopu scene with his barely contained rejection is very much like watching someone possessive force their way into someone's center of attention. I feel like if not for Disney, those scenes could have been more like the drammatic scenes in TWEWY. Where it's still for kids but just a little bit aggressive

>>4316
I would have believed more in Sora and Kairi growing apart if KH3/Re:mind did not force them so much. It's as if the writers knew they didn't spend nearly enough time developing the supposed main couple so they tried to hammer in scenes with them as much as possible.
They were way more touchy-feely in this game compared to the others, they hug and hold hands constantly.
In the Keyblade Graveyard Sora says that Kairi was the light that made him find his way back and he feels strong with her (probably because she's so useless lmao)
Xehanort kills Kairi to give Sora motivation like he's Vergil, that was pretty much confirmation that she is the most important person to him
In Re:mind during their team attack vs Xehanort, they were holding hands and all their scenes together were shown framed by angel wings, who else has anything close to that with Sora? Riku did not even have a team attack with him in Re:mind.
Sorry for sounding like a bitter fujo but I have no hope. If they actually kiss in KH4 I wouldn't be surprised.

>>4321
>If they actually kiss in KH4
fujoshi 9/11

>>4321
I'm genuinely tempted to play in Japanese for any further development because the localized version ruined almost everything.

Also, how is Kairi his guiding light when she appeared BEHIND him?

>>4323
I don't know how nihongo jyouzu you are but the actual complexity isn't that bad plus all of the cutscenes are subtitled in Japanese as well. You can pause and look up words if needed. I play in Japanese and didn't even know about the "aitsu" turned into "she" thing in CoM. What a fucking mess.

>>4324
>I play in Japanese and didn't even know about the "aitsu" turned into "she" thing in CoM.

Just going to casually drop the essay by the fantranslator.
https://drive.google.com/file/d/16AxlMB61mYsP3_8M0tOCxSka-wb0_yZp/view

>>4322
Let's pray Nomura would have more sympathy for his fujo fanbase and wouldn't go that far.

>>4325
Gotta love fujos writing 360 pages analyzing a game because they love a ship so much. That's pure love right there.

>>4325
Thank you for sharing!

>>4322
It says a lot that they created a new female character that got more development than Kairi and is probably going to interact with Sora a lot more, Strelitzia.
>>4312
Plus Sora disappearing right after reuniting with Kairi doesn't really look good in terms of destinied love, we got an entire game full of soriku with DDD, and Riku is the one that went looking for Sora in the new different dimension.
The Sokai dlc in KH3 was just a way to give closure to the Sora and Kairi subplot from KH1, I don't think they will focus on it anymore.

>>4332
>Strelitzia
Are the mobile games worth it? I don't know anything about the lore revolving around Foretellers and Dandellions so I will probably be very confused playing KH4 but I can't bring myself to watch youtube playthroughs.
>Sora disappearing right after reuniting with Kairi doesn't really look good in terms of destinied love
Sora always loses Kairi after spending the whole game chasing after her, this is nothing new. At the end of KH1 they got separated after finding each other, in KH2 he had to leave the islands after rescuing her, in KH3 he once again disappeared after saving her and left her a grieving widow
~~~Thinking of you, wherever you are~~~ is SoKai's whole deal.

>>4334
Watch a cutscene movie, there's multiple. Do NOT watch that shitty fandub. It's mid at best but a more accurate word is college indie movie.

I liked watching it as a Playlist but I think the uploader I liked deleted all their videos because I do not see them. They had all the major scenes, a cute MC that didn't take me out of the story (Named Player of all things for that comfy y/n mood) and it was orderly. After that- Back Cover, the real movie, will make a lot more sense. You could watch Back Cover before or after- because it takes place before the mobile title, but was meant to be seen after playing the browser version.

>>4334
yeah and their whole deal is very cringe tbh, imagine liking a couple where their whole mantra is based on being separated. It stopped being cute after KH1.

>>4335
Thanks! I'll get around to watching it someday. A shame about the fandub being mid, I feel that characters like MoM lose all their charm when not voiced. I loved MoM in re:mind purely because of his VA. Picrel.

>>4339
Being separated but still thinking of each other is common in KH. Aqua, Terra and Ventus were separated for ten years but never stopped wanting to be reunited, Axel was crying when he saw Xion in Kairi even though he did not remember her. The strength of bonds that transcends time and all that.
While it works for friends, it doesn't work as well for a romantic couple. Donald and Goofy know Sora better than Kairi does at this point. They were together almost every point of Sora's adventures, they saw him grow while Kairi was going to school or whatever else she was doing.

>>4340
Huh, yeah no. If you are going to base a relationship on transcendental mumbo jumbo, the bare minimum is to give that relationship actual screen time, and not barely five minutes of small talk.
You are supposed to show, not tell, and what the game does is they tell you Sora and Kairi are close.
Hell Sora and Riku have a better defined relationship simply thanks to how strong their banter was back in KH1 and KH2.
The only KH trio aside from Sora, Donald and Goofy, that worked for me was Xion, Axel, and Roxas, but that’s because I actually played Days. As for Aqua, Terra, and Ventus, they’re easily the weakest trio sorry. Their dynamic just doesn’t hold up, and bbs is unironically one of my favorite KH games, up with re:chain of memories. None of the characters feel that close aside from Terra and Aqua and even then they come across as lovers who still haven't gotten together more than best friends (unlike Sora and Kairi lol)
The Sora, Riku and Kairi trio is slightly better simply because it's carried by Sora and Riku's dynamics.

Kingdom Hearts overall has pretty childish writing. The themes are generic platitudes about friendship, and ironically, the most fleshed-out parts of the games are in the Disney worlds.

But the weakest element of all? Definitely the "romance" between Sora and Kairi. It's barely there, yet the game tries to sell it like it's profound. It’s not.

>>4342
>Kingdom Hearts overall has pretty childish writing
Anon. Check the age rating. The writing isn't weak you just clearly are biased.

And before you say that's not an excuse, media for all ages does not always NEED to be Shakespearean or adult. Kingdom Hearts has always been open, honest, and doesn't insult the viewer with a gotcha nor does it try to make you feel bad about wanting two characters to be friends.

If childish writing bothers you so much then maybe pure western media is more your speed. Though anyone who complains about childish writing is almost always unhappy unless it conforms to their warped view of maturity and are ashamed of not meeting those expectations

>>4343
Adding on to this with a more critical point of view.
Weakness one, easily, obfuscation. KH1 is KH in its barest bones form. It was a standalone game and that was all it was gonna be. Final Mix on is where Nomura and his writers began adding more filling to a complete product. So when he adds more story, it is with the intention of filling in the context for new story. Writer's don't magically have every answer, but he is not a novelist. He's not writing something for a book. He's adding details in places people wouldn't think to look. And relying on fans to be obsessive over those. That isn't a good trait for the mass public.

It's a unique story the more he adds on, unique takes that give it a tone of its own at times. Sometimes that tone is a little bit deaf, but a lot of that comes off unintentionally (Terra at Disney Town talking about the darkness.) Sometimes I wonder if it was intentional to make his development team laugh. Regardless, it's engaging if you aren't trying to guess, deconstruct and judge everything all the time. I've watched so many personalities refuse to let the story do its thing and then blame the game for their problem. It's not the game sometimes- it's the players. As a reverse, imagine playing DOOM or Wolfenstein and being upset it doesn't have a heartfelt story. Kingdom Hearts wears what it is openly, which baffles people. Openess is always associated with childishness, weakness and shame. Specifically to western viewers.

It's true weakness comes from the time between games, and Nomura trying to use all these literary tools, themes and hidden double messages spread out over platform and medium.

He wont just make it straightforward. And in turn, you get a badly localized mess on top of being unable to instantly connect what's going on because you didn't play the Japanese browser game. Back Cover being a prequel while Union is not the same game leaves a sizable gap of background that makes what's going on make more sense. The events of the original Unchained browser game do get a breif, but that's not the same as integration.

Kingdom Hearts resonates with people, and that is the most important thing. Who cares if benign friendship is for children. Sora's a childish kid, protag to a game for children and I think it's impressive Nomura can squeeze a story about said kid murdering his way through a pristine cage as its occupants try to brainwash him and it didn't trigger an instant no from disney

>>4343
>check the rating
>The writing isn't weak
I called it childish, and you just agreed it's for kids, so if it's not weak than it means it's good for kids, ok so the writing of KH is ok for 12 years olds, nice gotcha.
Jokes aside, Kingdom Hearts has writing issues, especially after KH1. Even the most dedicated fans critique how bloated and convoluted the plot has become. Saying it doesn’t need to be Shakespeare isn’t a defense, it’s a deflection. No one is asking for Shakespeare. People are asking for cohesive storytelling in a multi-title franchise that spans decades and platforms.

>It doesn’t make you feel bad for wanting characters to be friends.
That has nothing to do with the writing quality. If you're that defensive over fans criticizing storytelling choices, not your ship or your nostalgia, you might be too personally attached to the franchise. You don't need to project guilt or shame on others just because they expect more from a series.

>warped view of maturity
That’s some next-level projection. I could flip that logic and argue that people who aggressively defend media made for kids are just stuck in nostalgia loops and emotionally dependent on childhood comfort stories. That doesn’t invalidate their enjoyment, but it also doesn’t mean the writing is above critique.

>Nomura isn’t a novelist.
No, but he is a writer, and when you're crafting a multi-game narrative across more than ten titles, that comes with expectations. Relying on obsessive fans to connect dots across Japanese-exclusive browser games, mobile side content, cryptic secret movies, and mistranslated lines isn't deep. It's inaccessible. That’s not complexity, that’s poor storytelling design for a mass market game.



>It’s not the game sometimes, it’s the players.
That line says everything. If your story only works when the audience doesn't think, doesn't question, and doesn't miss content from obscure side titles, then the problem is the game. This is entertainment, not a cult manual.

>Kingdom Hearts resonates with people.
Sure, so do Gacha games or Twilight. Resonance doesn’t equal quality. And loving something doesn't mean you can't call out its flaws. KH has good moments, great ones, but pretending it's 2deep4you when it heavily relies on Disney for most of the plot it's just nonsense.
If it wasn't for Disney, Kingdom Hearts would be just another FF, or another game focused on friendship like the thousands of Japanese rpgs that share the same exact theme, like Persona or even The world ends with you.

>>4312
>She has a personality?
I think her KH1 design is a banger and seeing her go from that to "just some girl" in KH2 and 3 to be more in line with her lack of a personality was a little depressing. I'm in a weird spot as a fujo where yeah I love my ship fodder but I'm continually let down by what happens to the "main girl" in shonen-tier media. Looking at the early concept art makes me think she would have been more endearing. Her bonking the shit out of this heartless is super cute (and Riku being extra fruity with that pool stick move).
>>4346
>the bright, solar-type protagonist who sees the best in everyone
I really need jp writers to understand that these characters are built for getting their back blown out by their rival and nothing else.

>>4349
Back to Fujoposting, Sora and Riku are the my favorite couple. Riku's jealousy over Sora created some of the best angst content.

>>4349
That concept art made my day wow
>I'm continually let down by what happens to the "main girl" in shonen-tier media
Same, I'm also tired of really lame useless female characters. I just want a good story. I would rather just have female characters not exist in situations like this vs them just existing to be love interests on the sidelines. Imagine how much worse Hunter x Hunter would be if there was just two girl characters waiting around for Gon and Killua to return from their adventures or something lmfao.

>>4350
I like SoRiku stories that go into Riku's jealousy and even superiority complex over Sora kek. I want to inject internalized homophobia and denial of his attraction to Sora into my headcanon narrative
>there's no way I could be attracted to Sora
>Sora's worse than me
>but I wish I could be like Sora
>there's no way I could be gay
this makes me want to write fic again with some sort of Giovanni's Room-type style headfuck kek, but I'm not super great at writing

>>4342
>The Sora, Riku and Kairi trio is slightly better simply because it's carried by Sora and Riku's dynamics.
That trio is barely even a trio. Riku and Kairi are not friends and their relationship revolves around Sora only. They are both too jealous of the other's bond with Sora to be friends properly. Riku was worried about her in KH1 but only out of guilt over what he's done. In KH2 he helped her out but was not agonizing over cutting her off from his life like he was with Sora. He could have visited her anytime at the islands, but he only did so when Sora woke up. In the paopu scene in KH3 she disregarded Sora's worries that Riku was distancing himself just so she can have her special moment with him. If Kairi and Riku were actual friends she wouldn't let Riku isolate himself like that. When Riku thought he wasn't worthy of being around Sora anymore and was fine with never seeing him again, Sora searched for him everywhere, reassured him that they're still friends and dragged him back to the islands. Riku and Kairi never go to such lenghts for each other.
Sorry nonna but the BBS trio at least care about each other equally.

>>4350
SoRiku are the central relationship in the series (not SoKai).
Days/KH2 is my favorite era for them because it's so angsty. Anytime I think that Sora doesn't know that Riku spent an entire year keeping watch over him, sacrificing his body in the process, I want to cry. Riku's love for Sora is so big and Sora will probably never know the full extent of it. In KH2 Mulan's world, Riku seeing Sora and not being able to resist sparring with him because he misses him so much just fucking gets me. Sora recognizing Riku just from his presence in that fight because he knows him so well… tell me that's not true love.

>>4351
Sometimes I think I wouldn't mind SoKai being canon only because that would intensify Riku's jealousy and quiet yearning but then I stop myself because it would be too cruel for him. He should enjoy beautiful lovemaking with Sora everyday of his life.

>>4351
Exactly, when I think of games with solid romance, Final Fantasy X and Shadow Hearts come to mind right away. The female leads in those stories play active roles, which really helps the emotional arcs.
In general thou I think the Final Fantasy series does a better job handling female characters, even though I still really like Aqua and Namine.

I also like to imagine that when they were younger, Riku was a bit hesitant about letting Kairi into their friend group. It always felt like Sora and Riku mostly stuck to each other, and Kairi was kind of the newcomer. So it's fair to say that, with all of Riku’s jealousy toward Sora, he never fully embraced that trio dynamic Sora seemed to want. It’s kind of funny how both Riku and Kairi just want Sora for themselves, while Sora’s just off being his usual clueless self.